[My interpretation]
…below is a short summary of the beginning of a semon by John MacArthur, an elder statesman in the movement…
Close enough to count as a Freudian slip.
There's so much nonsense flying about on this thread that I think to avoid getting dragged into it and for the sake of my own sanity and respect for other people the sensible thing to do is to mute it.
The irony of my feeling I have to leave the discussion because of posts made by religious moralists is not lost on me, just so you know.
Is irony the right word? Is there a term for irony that also means really bitter and shitty? I dunno, anyway you get my point.
Winjim has form for hysterically threatening to flounce from threads, and yes, I use the H word advisedly, though I know not the sex.
Spoiler
I’ve not hit the ignore button yet, but to clarify it's more to prevent myself reacting in what would be an antagonistic and hostile manner and would not move the discussion forwards in a constructive manner.
I hold to my initial point that I don't consider this a debate. I would consider it disrespectful to people directly affected by the provision of abortion care for two cis men to be arguing over religion in this thread, so I'm removing the temptation for me to get involved in such an argument.
It's fascinating to me that I still don't know for sure, despite what at first appears to be a self ID; words are such slippery devils. But it matters not. Testerically works just as well.
Count your blessings* to have as part of such a discussion the unliked Unkraut, preacher men
being thin on the ground here. It gives folks (I also use
the F word advisedly) the opportunity to show their tolerance, expound rationally, and rise above. Or at least take a stab at it.
I seem to have a very busy week / life coming up…
I'm confident Mudsticks will find time to come back and glower periodically. It's just too tempting.
I might be tempted to say that the breathtaking ignorance, and arrogance displayed by some 'debating' this issue, on here, whilst possessing no 'uterus in the game' absolutely beggars belief .
I would say that...
But in fact it does no such thing, it's just routine behaviour, from people who feel their 'opinion' is as valid as anyone elses, however ignorant they may be.
Unless I'm parsing that wrong, a charge of ignorance has just been flung at someone who is quite articulate, which would be…
ironic.* A bit strong perhaps, but seriously, should you manage to whittle the forum down to people who don't challenge you, your mind will become a very dull instrument. Take
another site I frequent, where they also spend a lot of time preaching to the choir (something most of us have a high tolerance for). Without onslaught from those who in my opinion lack knowledge and awareness, connoisseurs of logic wouldn't have such a banquet to feast upon.
One of my problems with this is that modern secularists assert that if a man says he is a woman, then he is (as you well know!) whilst at the same time being unable to give a definition of what a woman is.
As you well know, views on this topic (irrelevant here) are not divided along religious lines and there are a range of views completely unrelated to whether someone believes in a god or not.
You can't defend women's rights if you're unclear what a woman is (
is there an echo in here?); and indeed, some trans volk are having
an attack of the vapours that their voices aren't sufficiently centred in this conversation.
For thou didst form my inward parts,
thou didst knit me together in my [pregnant person’s] [thing the front hole leads to].
I praise thee/them, for they is fearful and wonderful.
Wonderful are thy works!
Thou knowest me right well;
my frame (not that one) was not hidden from thee,
when I was being made in secret,
intricately wrought in the depths of the earth.
Thy eyes beheld my unformed and unassigned substance;
in thy book were written, every one of them,
the days that were formed for me,
when as yet there was none of them.
There exist people with deeply held 'controversial' opinions and beliefs that are widely viewed as unacceptable, even outrageous - so should we respect the views of those who think black people are not deserving of equal rights? That homosexuality should be outlawed and gay people criminalised? That women should have no autonomy over their own bodies?
Any moderately unignorant person will be able to tell which of those is not like the others.
For the record, I straddle the Unkraut/AuroraSaab line.
Everything is there from conception. If that is not the case, when do the unborn become human? When do they cease to be part of the mother's body?
This is not as a rule how people view the unborn if the subject is not abortion. When colleagues or friends have got pregnant they never talk about having a foetus, they are expecting a baby, and if they sadly have a miscarriage they mourn the loss. It's not like having a tooth or appendix out. Babies born very prematurely can now be saved by near miraculous medical intervention, and it is a baby, a human being that is saved and that all rejoice over.
worth a reprint:Re male input into a decision about termination. You would hope that most people were in relationships where they could come to the decision that was right for them together. But ultimately it has to be the woman's decision because pregnancy can be physically dangerous and having a child you don't want can be hugely psychologically damaging. That's not to say that these issues don't affect the male; most men are devastated by a partners miscarriage for example. However, the risks and hardships of pregnancy, both medical and emotional, are almost exclusively borne by the woman so the decision must lie with them.
I think life starts pretty damn early, but for practical reasons women get to decide its fate. Blame god for the parasitical nature of mammalian sexual reproduction.
That said, to put half the species on mute (as if that were possible – sorry winjim) for only having prostate in the game also shows a certain lack of
In other business…Any Questions was pretty good this week.
I find this allegation preposterous.
Sorry, I misread that as Question Time. Any Questions has indeed been known to achieve pretty goodness.
